GROOVE IS IN THE HEART

Rhythm Magazine, September 2001

by Mark Walker

For nigh-on 30 years, the name Steve Gadd has been synonymous with the groove. From his seminal work in the jazz world with the likes of Chick Corea and Stuff, to his more mainstream classics with Steely Dan and Paul Simon, Steve's playing has always added something beyond value to the music. A rare audience with Rhythm led to this revealing portrait of the artist.

Getting hold of Steve Gadd is a little like diving for pearls: exciting, nerve-wracking, a bit perilous, rarely successful. But when you finally do succeed, all the effort, endeavour and diligence are immediately forgotten, and you are left elated by the prize: pearls of wisdom from one of the biggest influences in drumming history.

For the uninitiated, Steve Gadd is regarded by most of today's top players as the ultimate groove master, with a style that is unique and a feel that touches on the divine. He may be Gadd Almighty to a whole generation of players, but he's not always been an angel. A long and well-documented struggle with drugs and alcohol brought on by his punishing workload was eventually kicked in the late 80s, when his love of music and playing drums were rejuvenated. Testament to his standing in the league of great drummers is the fact that, along with John Bonham, Steve came joint first as the drummer with the most entries in Rhythms Top 100 Beats Of All Time issue two years ago.

The last time we tried to hook up with Steve was on his four-day visit to the UK, towards the end of last year. Unfortunately, as he was in the studio with Eric Clapton by day and gigging with Paul Simon by night, his spare time was non-existent (although that gives you a good idea of how in demand he still is). Happily, he recently came back for a longer stint to tour the UK with Clapton, giving us the chance to bag our man, although even that took the application of near-supernatural organisational skills.

When we meet at last, Steve is looking tired and things are a little slow at first. He's been away from home for a couple of months and the flu bug has just gone through the band. He's humble, a little nervous, pensive and very deliberate in his answers, but things slowly warm up, until -- after we've been speaking for the best part of an hour -- we discover why Steve Gadd is such a hard man to tie down...

"I don't really like doing interviews," he says. It's a funny situation to be in. You know, for me to start talking about me, if I started to do a lot of these things, and started to really believe in what I was saying, I might be in trouble -- you know what I mean? My best days are the days when I wake up realising that I don't really know the answers and I've got something to learn, and I don't try to run the whole show. Those are better days for me.

That was at the end of our chat, though, and, as you'll see, he certainly does have plenty of the answers. But lets begin at the beginning...

Rhythm: How are you, Steve?

Steve Gadd: Yeah, I'm good, you know? I'm out here, the band is good, it's nice to be on a world tour working with a good band. Nathan East is playing bass, there's Andy Fairweather-Low on guitar, David Sancious is playing keyboard, myself, Paulinho da Costa is playing percussion, and for the Albert Hall and the concerts in the UK, The Impressions are singing background. And Eric, of course. So it's a great tour.

- Do you know what material you're doing as far as sets go?

- We're sort of working it out now, but were doing a little bit of everything. We're doing some unplugged things, we're doing some blues, some older things and a couple of tracks from the new album that hasn't come out yet. There's also some things from Pilgrim, so it really covers a lot of ground.

- Prior to this, you did the Paul Simon tour. How did that go?

- That went very well, too. It was very well received. He has a new album out and he went out to get behind the album, so it was good.

- You've worked with Paul Simon for over 25 years now, and his material has evolved with many new influences. When he brings you a song, does he give you an idea of what he wants, or do you have free rein?

- It varies. He's come with songs that we've worked on, and then we've gone in and just recorded. On this album, we went in and recorded drums and percussion, and just different grooves, and he would sort of direct us as to how long this section should be. Now lets go here. But there's different ways of doing it with Paul. There's no magic formula, it's trial and error.

- It's interesting that you worked with the percussion early on. On the new album, you leave a lot of space for the percussion for fills, like on the title track, "You're The One." Is that orchestrated beforehand, or does it just happen improvisationally?

- Paul sort of orchestrates the whole thing. He's very good at taking something and then using it very tastefully, and that's the way he did it. And now, with modern technology, with Protools you can sort of piece things together, so some of it was done that way as well.

- Do you enjoy collaborating with percussionists in general?

- It depends on the percussionist, that's really it. If you're working with someone that's a good percussionist and good musician -- and that would mean someone who listens real hard and leaves some space -- then it's enjoyable. If it's a situation where you've got to fight for a space, then it's not too much fun, it makes the job more difficult. So it's like anything else -- if the people can play, then it's enjoyable.

- If we can go back to when you started as a drummer, you had a very varied musical education in music school, college, the army and with an orchestra. How important do you think that was for your career?

- I think it was important for me, because in classical stuff, I learned not only how to read, but playing in an orchestra and following a conductor -- that's helpful. And the rudimental stuff that I did, I've been able to apply to different musical situations -- I like a wide variety of musical situations, so all that stuff was important for me. Even though there was a big variety when I was young, I was able to enjoy each one, I was able to get into each one. And then, after I had a little bit of experience in different fields, I sort of gravitated to the one that felt the most comfortable for me. The set of drums was something that I could have more fun spending time with than, say, timpani or xylophone. But I think I've been able to apply all those things, so for me it's been helpful.

- You mention reading. According to legend, Steely Dan's Donald Fagen was stunned that you sight-read the whole of Aja on the second take. How necessary has reading been for your work?

- At different times during my recording career, it's been very important. It's not important for every type of situation, but for the stuff I did for Chick Corea, it was very important for me to able to read. Things with Bob James, a lot of those kind of things, recording jingles and any kind of film work, plus a lot of fusion and more complicated types of music. It was very important, because there was no way to memorise that kind of stuff. For the more pop stuff, a lot of it's just a lead sheet. You don't have to read drum parts, but to be able to do it, it's helpful.

- Do you have to read much these days with the work you're getting?

- I don't do as much now, but if it came up I could. I'm glad that I can do it, I think it's good that I can read, and I'm glad that I spent the time learning. It wasn't easy. The other thing that I learned when studying is that, as difficult as it was trying to learn how to read, at one point, as confusing as it all seems, in a flash it all starts to get clear. I don't know when that happens, but that's a nice thing for me to understand about the way I learned -- that if I keep at it long enough, sooner or later it's going to get clearer.

- Does that apply to everything?

- It definitely applies to the reading. I don't know how long I would spend doing something that I wasn't understanding if it wasn't that important to me, if it wasn't to do with music. But if I really wanted to do something, I'd know that if I kept at it long enough, sooner or later, if it was important enough to me, I'd get it and be able to do it. If you just keep at it long enough and you want to do it bad enough, it'll happen. The thing is, it doesn't happen overnight. If you're looking for a quick fix, if you're looking to be able to do something overnight, it's not going to happen. But if you spend the time at it, then the rewards are pretty high.

- Many of the songs you've performed on during your career are regarded as classic drum tracks, such as Aja and 50 Ways. When you were originally recording and creating those, were you aware at the time of how revolutionary and important they were from the drumming perspective?

- No, I wasn't aware at the time, and I'm flattered by the things that people say and how they've inspired people, but I don't even know if I'm aware now, you know what I mean? That stuff just comes out. If it's in you, sometimes you need people to bring it out of you, so I was lucky enough to be in a situation where the music brought things out of me. I mean, 50 Ways, I used to practise those kind of things as exercises, and it was just luck that I was able to try it on that song and have the producer and Paul say, Okay, lets do that. But you don't know when you do the track if it's going to be a hit or not.

- But you must look back with some degree of pride...

- I'm very proud, though I don't know if I'm as proud as I am grateful for the opportunities. I've had a lot of opportunities to do a lot of different things with a lot of great people, and that's something to be grateful for. I'm proud of the fact that I've known these people, and that I'm friends with some of them. That's something that I'm proud of.

- It's admirable that you're being so modest, but you've actually been quite integral to the sound and success of some of those artists.

- Yeah, but actually, when you get hired as a musician on a recording session, that can be part of the job. Some jobs can be where you just read the music, other things can be where they want you to come in and offer something creatively. And so for me, I consider myself lucky to have had a variety of different situations and the outcomes were pretty cool.

- These days, because you've had so many cool outcomes, you're generally asked to do a session because of what you bring to the table. Do you feel any pressure from that?

- I don't, really, because I think the main thing that I bring to the session isn't any kind of preconception of what I've got to do when I get there. The first thing I've got to do is to throw all that stuff out and just listen to what the music is on that particular day. Because I'm not going to determine what the music is, it's going to determine what I do. If I go in there with a clear head, then I've got a better shot at doing what's best for the music. So the main challenge is to get out of my own way, and just listen to the music before I play it, and listen to what people are verbalising that they want, and try to interpret that musically. Because it's about me giving them what they need, it's not about me getting off. Though quite often that's what they might want from you. I don't know, I think that maybe years ago there was that sort of attitude where they wanted that kind of energy, but now a lot of the work I'm doing, they want you to listen and play the music, and I like that. I like it when it's okay for me to just go and play.

- When you play, do you have any kind of spiritual approach towards what you do?

- I believe in a higher power, and what I've learned is that spirituality is a lot different to just religion. So I hope that spirituality enters into my playing. Although it's not because that's what I decide to do right before I play as much as, hopefully, that's the way I'm trying to live my life. And the playing is an extension of that.

- I remember reading once that seeing Chick Corea play your kit had a profound effect on your approach to playing.

- Yeah, I was playing with Chuck Mangione and Chick Corea, Joe Romano and Frank Pullara was bass player, and Chick and Chucky had been working with Art Blakey's band, and I'd just been in Rochester. Anyway, I just saw Chick sit down at the drums and he was doing things that Tony Williams did. And to try and figure that out by listening was really difficult, but when you saw someone approach the drums that way, it just opened up a door for me and yes, that helped me tremendously.

- We're mostly aware these days of the mainstream acts you've been working with, like Eric Clapton and Paul Simon. Do you miss the jazz and fusion side of things, or do you still get a chance to play all of that stuff?

- I'm pretty much happy with what I'm doing. I try to stay focused on what I'm doing while I'm doing it, and I'm feeling pretty fulfilled with the jobs I'm getting. I was doing some stuff with Michel Petrucciani, though he's not with us any more. I miss him. He was a lot of fun and that was a nice little trio. But I still get a variety of things. The other thing is, if there was anything I really wished I was doing that I'm not doing, then I could always put it together myself if I wanted to do it bad enough. So I'm pretty thankful for the work I'm getting, I feel pretty lucky, and I'm happy to be playing with the people I am.

- Ever think about putting a version of the Gadd Gang back together?

-You know, I think about it every once in a while, but that thing was with Richard Tee. He was a real good friend of mine. That group just played itself. It was pretty painless to put together. It was a real natural hang. We were all willing to share everything completely.

- Finally, you've worked with so many incredible musicians and artists in your life. Is there anyone you haven't worked with that you'd like to?

- Well, I like Prince, he's a great artist. But I'm not up on all the new artists. Let me tell you something. If someone is serious about what they're doing -- in other words, if they're doing it from their heart -- then I'd love to make music with them. It's not about whether they have a name or not, it's about where they're coming from. Because when they're honest and sincere about music, it's a great experience to share with other people.